[Kadam] [SPAM?] Fw: trans

[Hermann Philipps]

O kekadämans stimik!

Dotob tefü geb präpoda: love < ad malön eli ‚trans’ ön siäm nevoik.
Ma sev obik präpod at te pagebon ön siäm topik: love mel/flumed/jot, e r.
Zuo vöds: ‚transgender’ e ‚trans’ no binons balsinifiks (leigoäs el 
‚meme’).
Kludo fikulos ad datikön vödi te Volapükiki.
Ibä vöds at niludo pogebons nesuvo u neföro in vödems Volapükik, mobob 
das geboyös vödis Linglänapükik (kels pagebons id püks votik): ‚trans’ 
e ‚transgender’ < as foginavöds in vödems Volapükik.
Ad fomön ladyekis ba kanoy gebön eli „di”, do voiko vödül at rigo 
äjonidon ad fomön ladyekis te de nems, as sam: flad di ‚Leiden’.

Leigo – e demü kods ot – cedob, das bo kanoy gebön vödi: ‚gender’ as 
foginavöd in vödems Volapükik, if desiroy ad kurato malön eli ‚social 
gender role’.

Lestümiko,
Hermann.
---------------

Am 11.10.2020 um 18:52 schrieb Dan Morosof:
> 
> 
> ----- Пересылаемое сообщение -----
> *От:* Donald Gasper <don_gasper at outlook.com>
> *Кому:* Dan Morosof <shido2308 at yahoo.com>
> *Отправлено:* воскресенье, 11 октября 2020 г., 21:50:24 GMT+5
> *Тема:* Re: trans
> 
> Baicedob. *Lovegenan jinon binön pötöfik.
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* Dan Morosof <shido2308 at yahoo.com>
> *Sent:* Monday, October 12, 2020 12:30 AM
> *To:* Kadäm Volapüka <kadam at evertype.com>; hphilipps at onlinehome.de 
> <hphilipps at onlinehome.de>; Brennus Volapükan 
> <brennusvp at legranus.me.uk>; Arden R. Smith <erilaz at earthlink.net>; 
> Daniel Zhang <dannyzhang99 at yahoo.com>; Igor Wasilewski 
> <espigor at gmail.com>; Michael Everson <everson at evertype.com>; Donald 
> Gasper <don_gasper at outlook.com>
> *Subject:* trans
> O kekadämans stimik!
> 
> Semikna kompenob pö bespiks ai fenüköls Volapükagrupa ela ‘Discord’ 
> labü nem “Volapükan”. Enu säkäd vödas eli ‘LGBT’ tefölas päbespikon. 
> Ekö! dil primik spikota:
> 
> El “MonitanBlövik”: i don't even know if we have a word for 
> transgender in volapük
> trans- means "over" so it could be lovegenik
> El “MäntafivKvadik”: we tried once
> El “MonitanBlövik”: but sometimes volapük words have to be a lot more 
> specific
> El “MäntafivKvadik”: votgenan
> El “MonitanBlövik”: vot is not a preposition so it would be votagenan
> El “MäntafivKvadik”: looks like a discrepancy with votgeniäl but it's 
> still clear for me
> yes that
> El “MonitanBlövik”: -iäl means an inclination, and in more cases than 
> not it's pejorative
> so i don't know if it's suitable
> i approve of its usage in a non-pejorative situation
> but still.. is it a tendency?
> El “MäntafivKvadik”: idk I thought we planned it
> votageniäl for homosexuality
> that's why I say votagenan
> El “MonitanBlövik”: i think it's itgeniäl
> votageniäl is heterosexuality
> El “MäntafivKvadik”: otgeniäl
> sorry yeah I mistook
> El ‘Shido’: As I know, dictionaries of Midgley and Cherillod have the 
> word "otgeniälan" for a homosexual.
> El “MäntafivKvadik”: votageniäl - heterosexuality
> votageniälan - straight
> otgeniäl - homosexuality
> otgeniälan - gay
> 
> otgenan - trans?
> 
> Täno pos vestig brefüpik äkanob nunön, das diatek nulik Volapükik 
> gevon tefü ‘homosexual’ vödi: “otgenageniälan” (logolsös penedi balid 
> elanes di ‘Corinthos’: VI, 9!)
> El “geniäl” sinifon dranäli genik, äsä vödemadiled sököl jonülon: “Ab 
> if ek cedom, das dunom nepötöfiko kol jigam okik, bi geniäl omik vedon 
> tu nämöfik” (pened balid elanes di ‘Corinthos’: VII, 36). Klu el 
> “otgenageniäl” kanon paplänön as geniäl kol gen ot, e fom: *otgeniälan 
> < se vödabuks anik binon neverätik. Id ämäniotob vödi: 
> "hi-vota-gena-klotemi-lenlaban", keli bü yels anik el Hermann istukom 
> ad leigätod ela ‘drag queen’ pö Volapükagrup ela ‘Facebook’. Ad jonön 
> lüodis mögik betika, äkoboädob vödis: *gügenokseved (stabü okseved as 
> ‘self-identification’) e *genavotükamiäl(an).
> Täno el “Monitan blövik” äpenom:
> 
> “1. I don't think the meaning of "person with an inclination for 
> gender change" is neuter enough. I am not an expert on the matter, but 
> many trans people never change their biological gender, and others I 
> think prefer to not think about it as a change, but as something they 
> always identified with
> 2. Let's take in consideration in the future practicality and length 
> when proposing a new word. The word above would just not be practical 
> if we are to use Volapük in a colloquial context. Translating the 
> notion as closely as possible does not always mean it's the best solution
> many auxlangs work in analogy with the international word, if they 
> don't adapt the word directly. the prefix "trans-" is translated with 
> "love-" in volapük. so a term like lovegenan would be easy to remember 
> and good enough to describe it.
> we're not making alien language or a polysynthetic word here where the 
> whole definition has to fit into a single word
> for "self identity" i would use
> "okdientif"
> it's closer to the international root and shorter
> while we're on it, we should change "dientifäd" which means "identity 
> card" to "dientifot" since it's a real, tangible object, not an 
> abstraction
> "hi-vota-gena-klotemi-lenlaban" i think is first of all misgendering 
> the singer ("she"), second of all it refers to transVESTITE people not 
> transSEXUAL, that is people who dress as the other gender, which might 
> or might not be trans
> and even in this case we can use the friendlier "lovegenikloteman" or 
> "votagenikloteman" ”
> 
> Cedob, das vöds: *lovegen ad ‘transsexuality’ e *lovegenan jinons 
> binön pötöfiks. Ud okanoy-la datikön vödis votik seimik labü binet: 
> “love”.
> Ba i binosös vipabik ad labön vödi ad ‘gender’, kel no ai baibinon 
> gen. Liedo no mögos ad gebön vödi: genät, bi ya dabinon subsat 
> “genätamahijip”. Ba odaloy-li gebön poyümotis votik, as sam: *genöf? 
> U-li igo el *genöfät?
> Ba i vöds votik siämagrupa at oklülädons-la zesüdön. Kisi cedols-li?
> 
> Ko lestüm,
> ‘Daniil’ ü ‘Shido’.
> 
> 
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